The event was participated by the representatives of National Assembly Committees including the NA Committee for Science, Technology and Environment, the NA Committee for Laws, the NA Committee for Social Affairs, The NA Committee for Foreign Affairs.

• PhD. Bui Sy Loi – The Deputy of National Assembly – The Vice Chairman of the NA Committee for Social Affairs
• Mr. Truong Minh Hoang – The Vice Chairman of the NA Committee for Science, Technology and Environment
• Mr. Nguyen Cong Hong – The Vice Chairman of the NA Committee for Laws
• Mr. Vu Hai Ha – The Vice Chairman of the NA Committee for Foreign Affairs

Along with the participation of the Deputies of National Assembly, the Standing Members, the Heads of Delegations, the representatives from different Ministries and Departments, as well as the experts and specialists in Heath, Economics, Building Materials and Legal sectors.

The think-tank began with the screening of a short-film that introduced chrysotile and its application in a variety of industries in Russia, Brazil, Thailand and Vietnam, and the impact of chrysotile on human health.

TOPIC 1 – THE USE OF CHRYSOTILE ALL OVER THE WORLD AND IN VIETNAM

Question 1

Mr. Nguyen Quoc Thang asked Associate.Prof Bach Dinh Thien – The Director of the Institute for Research and Application of the Tropical Building Materials, University of Construction – about chrysotile and the its use in Vietnam and other countries.

Answer:
According to Associate.Prof Bach Dinh Thien, the word asbestos is a commercial term to indicate any fibrous mineral with a fibrous form. In fact, there are many types of asbestos fibres which are divided into two families based on their differences in physical/chemical properties: the serpentine(white asbestos fibre) and the amphiboles (blue and brown asbestos fibre).

Amosite, crocidolite, tremolite, actinolite, and anthophyllite are all amphibole type of asbestos fibre, which is straight and needle-like and has a long half-life. Once in the human lung, amphibole fibre could cause tumors and inflammation symptoms. After 10 to 20 years of incubation, the tumor will develop into cancer and other lung related diseases.

The serpentine fibre group, including chrysotile asbestos (or white asbestos), is curly and soft, which makes it the only approved type of asbestos to be commercialized today – most commonly for industrial purposes. The group is put under the list of low biopersistent chemicals, much lower than glass wool fibre. According to scientific researches, after entering human body via inhalation, chrysotile fibre will be disposed from the lung in 0,3 to 11 days or decomposed by the acid environment created by the macrophage.

Chrysotile is commonly used in construction materials production especially in fibro cement roof sheets and water pipes. From 1920 to 1980, chrysotile was used in 3 million kilometers of pipes. Currently, there has been speculation on the risk of chrysotile in water from chrysotile-containing pipes; however, the scientific evidence has confirmed that chrysotile in water pipe is harmless to human health. Therefore, chrysotile asbestos is currently used under control in 147 countries including the United States, Russia, Brazil, China, India, Thailand, etc.

During the World War II, many Western Europe countries and Japan used amphibole asbestos in weapon and war vehicle production without any proper exposure protection, which was the cause of many asbestos-related diseases in these countries today. That is the reason for the anti-asbestos forces nowadays.

Question 2:

Mr. Nguyen Quoc Thang asked Mr. Pham Van Bac – The Director of the Department of Building Materials, Ministry of Construction – the reason why some countries have banned the use of chrysotile?

Answer:
Chrysotile has been used in Vietnam for more than 54 years. Its use was once banned by the government due to the negative impact on human health. However, the ban was later revoked due to the lack of scientific evidence.

Amphibole asbestos is confirmed to be harmful to human health by many scientific studies. As for chrysotile, there have been many debates over its impact on human health, numerous scientific studies have indicated that it does not affect human health.

Question 3

Mr. Nguyen Quoc Thang asked Mr. Truong Minh Hoang – The Deputy of Ca Mau province – The Vice Chairman of the NA Committee for Science, Technology and Environment about the use of fibro cement roof sheets in Ca Mau province and the average price that the residents can pay for roofing.

Answer:

AC roof sheet is widely used in Mekong River Delta region and the mountainous areas. It is considered affordable and highly durable especially in alkaline environment, hoarfrost and salt water. The price of galvanized roof sheet is 40%-100% higher than the price of AC roof sheet. During transportation, the alkaline environment can damage the galvanized roof sheet in several months. In city and town areas, the galvanized roof sheet suppliers can guarantee the durability up to 5-6 months; however, no one gives the same promise if the buyer lives in saltwater environment.

Mr. Hoang believed that many participants had once lived under AC roofing. In fact, many people have used AC roof sheets for decades but they are still very healthy. Although many residents in Ca Mau province and Mekong delta even drink rain water from the AC roof sheet, the mortality of the region is comparable to the national rate.

According to Mr. Hoang, the Government has directed the use chrysotile under control, which is very suitable solution especially when the country still has to face many difficulties and many households still live in poverty. AC roof sheet is the preferred choice of the poor and lower-income families. Therefore, the Government should consider economic aspect when discussing chrysotile issues.

Question 3:

Mr. Nguyen Quoc Thang asked Mr.Pham Van Hoa, The Deputy Head of the delegation of the deputies in Dong Thap province about the awereness of the AC roof sheet and the voters’ concern on the resolution and the economic benefits if the AC roof sheet.

Answer:

According to the opinions of the voters, the AC roof sheet has superior characteristics with high durability. His family has used AC roof sheet with the durability from 15 to 20 years. This roof sheet is suitable for the weather in the Mekong Delta region. In the Program 135 and 167 of the Government on supporting the poor and near-poor households, people prefer AC roof sheets to other materials. AC roof sheet is irreplaceable in rural and mountainous areas. It is not objective to blame AC roof sheets for the cancer; it is necessary to conduct more researches on the impact of chrysotile on human health

Question 4:

Mr. Nguyen Quoc Thang asked for opinions of the participants on the use of chrysotile in Vietnam.

Mr. Vu Hai Ha – The Vice Chairman of the NA Committee for Foreign Affairs

He agreed with the superior characteristics of the fibro cement roof sheet especially in alkaline environment.
From the international trade perspective, Vietnam is one of the leading importers of chrysotile. Transparency is the most important principle in any Free Trade Agreement. The FTA requires member countries to respect the provisions and must not have any discriminating actions on any products without consultation and negotiations.

Personally, he thought that Vietnam should have a proper roadmap when there have not been any evidence on the impact of chrysotile. He added that the majority of the world still allowed using chrysotile under control; the anti-asbestos countries were the developed one and their economic development allowed them to use substitute products at higher prices. Therefore, Vietnam needed time to implement to ban.

Question 5:

Mr. Nguyen Quoc Thang asked Mr. Tong Van Nga – The former Deputy Minister of Construction – The president of the Vietnam Building Materials Association for opinions.

Answer:

Chrysotile was once banned in 2001 when Mr. Nga still worked at the Ministry of Construction; the ban was the result of the business competition of a Korean steel roofing firm. In 2004, the Prime Minister revoked the ban. Moreover, the Western world wants to put pressure on Russia – the world largest chrysotile exporter. In addition, the mass use of amphibole during the World War II in Western Europe has become the reason for the ban on the use of chrysotile.

TOPIC 2: THE RISKS OF CHRYSOTILE

Question 6:

Mr. Nguyen Quoc Thang asked Dr. Le Thi Hang – the director of the Hospital of Construction about the researches and activities to supervise the worker health in the construction industry.

Answer:

After mentioning the risks of asbestos in general, Mrs. Hang revealed the truth about the number “107.000” given by the World Health Organization. In fact, the number of death caused by mesothelioma during 19 years from 1994 to 2003 in 103 countries was 169.537 cases, in which the number of cases caused by asbestos was 8000 in the world.

The cause of cancer and lung diseases in Japan, Australia, Canada and Germany was the results of the misuse of amphibole in the past. In Japan, after 50 years, there were a large number of lung cancer and mesothelioma cases detected. After detecting a turmoil caused by mesothelioma, the doctor would cut it out, dry and crush it to find the fibers in lung tissue to define the compensation for the victims of asbestos.

Mrs. Hang demonstrated some domestic researches and results:

• In 2002-2003, a ministry level research was conducted by the Ministry of Natural Resources and Environment: “Research and assessment on asbestos cement roofing industry and the effects of chrysotile on human health – Recommendations for solutions”, the research concluded that “There have been no cases of malignant diseases such as bronchial lung cancer and mesothelioma associated with white asbestos.”
•  During 2009 – 2011 period, the Ministry of Health, Labour and Welfare via the World Health Organization (WHO), sponsored the Health Environmental Management Agency – Ministry of Health to conduct a ministry level research namely “Research on the asbestos related diseases in exposed people”. An interview was conducted in 447 cases of ARDs (in 3 years from 2009 to 2011, these cases are all ARDs including lung cancer, plural thickening and mesothelioma) submitted to 06 hospitals, the results showed that there were 46 cases diagnosed with mesothelioma. After selection, there were 39 samples sent to Hospital of Hiroshima in Japan. However, the Japanese experts confirmed that there was no direct occupational exposure to chrysotile in 08 cases of mesothelioma.
• Upon receiving the instruction of Mr. Hoang Trung Hai – the Deputy Prime Minister requesting the Ministry of Construction to conduct researches, evaluate and develop a plan to ban the importation of chrysotile, the Hospital of Construction had examined the workers and the end-users of fibro cement roof sheet. The research found 10 cases of calcified and thickening lung with the size less than 10mm. None of the lung cancer and mesothelioma had been detected.

Question 7:

Mr. Nguyen Quoc Thang asked PhD. Le Hong Tinh from the perspective of the NA Committee for Science, Technology and Environment about the safe limit of chrysotile exposure and if the ban is really necessary?

Answer:

According to PhD. Le Hong Tinh, the International Agency for Research on Cancer (IARC) of WHO classifies all types of asbestos in Group I of carcinogen. Some of the substances in Group I are currently used in birth control product, wine and beer, wood dust, rubber production, coal and mining industry, paint production industry.

Mr. Tinh mentioned the misunderstanding between chrysotile and amphibole asbestos. The majority of countries in the world still allow using chrysotile, the anti-asbestos countries are the minority. The safe limitation in Vietnam is 1.0 fiber/cm3 in 8 hours; this limit is similar to which in Europe. And most of the facilities has qualified the above standard.

Mr. Tinh delegated the Government delegation to visit Brazil where he witnessed the production technology and the documents relating to chrysotile. He emphasized how chrysotile was widely used in Brazil even in water tank.

He hoped that the scientists and the authorities would be more objective on this issue. In addition, he proposed to minimize the occupational exposure to chrysotile by requesting the facilities to comply with the regulated standard. The factories should equip the automatic technology especially in the bag-opening phase to minimize the exposure. He suggested putting the label to warn the users not to break the roof sheet which may disperse the fibers like any other fibers.

TOPIC 3: THE IMPACT OF CHRYSOTILE BAN ON ECONOMIC, SOCIAL AND FOREIGN AFFAIRS PERSPECTIVES

Question 8:

Mr. Nguyen Quoc Thang asked Mrs. Nguyen Minh Thao – the Head of the Business Environment and Competitiveness Board, the Center Institute on Economic Management- about the economic cost of the ban on chrysotile by 2020.

Answer:

Mrs. Thao presented the results of the research on the economic impact of chrysotile ban.

• The amount of money that consumers have to pay to replace AC roof sheets by PVA roof sheets is 183.5 trillion VND, this number varies from 300 to 600 trillion VND depending on the type of substitute products
• The economic cost for fiber cement roofing industry to upgrade technology, install new equipment and provide vocational training to employees is 395.2 million VND

Moreover, the Program 135 to support the rural poor has used a large number of AC roof sheets. If the ban is applied, the Government should replace the roofing in the old and up-coming project.

Chrysotile is listed as a conditional business line in the Investment Law in 2014. In the reviewing in 2016, chrysotile is still in the list, which indicates that the National Assembly allows using chrysotile in production under control.
She added that even in some countries with high environment standard such as Singapore and the United States, chrysotile was still in use.

Question 9:

Mr. Nguyen Quoc Thang asked Mr. Bui Sy Loi about the social impact of the ban on chrysotile.

Answer:

Mr. Loi used to work 5 years as the Chief Inspector of Occupational Safety and at the Committee for Social Affairs. He revealed that Vietnam had 17 ore mining points mostly located in Cao Bang, Hoa Binh, Son La, Thanh Hoa, Phu Tho with the capacity from 10,000 to 60,000 tons. Moreover, Vietnam has imported chrysotile to use in anti-friction materials, shipbuilding and repairing, boilers and AC roof sheet production.

As for the social impact, Mr. Loi recalled the lesions of the poppy and tobacco, once the ban was imposed, it was crucial to find the alternative crops to support the people.

Regarding the national security, in the Programs No.135, No.30a, No.167 on the housebuilding for the poor people, AC roof sheets have been used to build most of the houses.

In term of health impact, he suggested two solutions; the first one was to strictly comply with the occupational safety, and the second one was to equip automatic production technology to protect workers’ health.

Mr. Loi thought that it was necessary to find a substitute product; however, it was difficult to solve in the near future. He said: “If the ban was imposed, what should the families with fibro cement roofing do? Will we have enough money to handle this problem?”. Therefore, we should have a proper road map to solve this issue.

Question 10:

Mr. Nguyen Quoc Thang asked Mr.Vu Hai Ha about the impact of the ban by 2020 on the international agreements.

Answer:
The ban on chrysotile may potentially affect the international partnership especially when Vietnam has signed some Free Trade Agreements. Also, the Investment Law in 2014 has listed chrysotile as a conditional business line.

Question 11:

Mr. Nguyen Quoc Thang asked Mr. Ngo Vinh Bach Duong – the Head of Business Law Department, the Institute of State and Law – about the regulations and legal framework on the safe use of chrysotile.

Answer:

In 2015, the Institute of State and Law conducted a research on the chemicals safety; the research included a component on the regulation and legal framework on the safe use of chrysotile containing products. Vietnam legal framework has qualified the international standard. The anti-asbestos countries have confirmed the negative impact of chrysotile; however, if it is soaked in natural or artificial adhesive, there is no need to apply any safety regulations. Therefore, when chrysotile is pressed in cement mixture or in gasket, there is no need to apply safety regulation even in chrysotile-containing waste disposal. The United States once banned the use of chrysotile, but the Supreme Court later revoked the ban. Mr. Duong thought that the ban on chrysotile was the result of the competitiveness of the chrysotile-substitute industry that stood behind the social organizations.

Nonetheless, it is important to warn the employees and keep track on their profile as well as add the law on transportation and waste disposal of chrysotile- containing products.

Question 12:

Mr. Nguyen Quoc Thang asked Associate.Prof Luong Duc Long – The Director of the Institute of Building Materials about the chrysotile substitute products.

Answer:

After conducting researches on a variety of chrysotile alternative fibers, he concluded there were no exact chrysotile substitute fibers. According to researches, the PVC fiber can not compare to the chrysotile fiber in terms of bending load, flexural strength and thermal expansion. Moreover, the price of a PVC roof sheet is 40 to 60% higher than fibro cement roof sheet.

Question 13:

Mr. Nguyen Quoc Thang asked Mr. Nguyen Cong Hong – the Vice Chairman of the NA Committee for Laws to discuss the National Action Programme to Eliminate Asbestos Related Diseases by 2020 from the legal perspective.

Answer:

He stated that the primary aim of Government laws and policy was to benefit the citizens. During the think-tank, he found that chrysotile offered more benefits than its disadvantages because of the high market demand, the limitation of the substitute products and the lack of scientific evidence on the impact of chrysotile on human health. The Investment Law in 2014 has listed chrysotile as a conditional business line; and the Decree 24a allowed the use of chrysotile containing products under control.

He added that the priority of the Government was to protect people’ health. However, there were many other methods to eliminate asbestos-related disease, the ban on chrysotile was unnecessary. We can implement the legal framework once proving the impact of chrysotile on human health to protect the end-users and producers.

Question 14:

Mr. Nguyen Quoc Thang asked PhD. Le Hong Tinh about the feasibility of the National Action Programme to Eliminate Asbestos Related Diseases by 2020.

Answer:
According to PhD. Le Hong Tinh, the Government should consider the scientific evidence, legal framework and the economic development when reviewing the ban on chrysotile. The Ministries and Department should conduct more research to protect human health and ensure the economic and social development.

Overall, all of the participants agreed that chrysotile offered many economic and social benefits. The ban on chrysotile should be based on the scientific evidence, legal framework, international trade agreements and economic situation to ensure the fairness and objectivity for both consumers and producers.

Dai bieu Nhan dan Newspaper.
Photos: Duy Thong